Danielle (00:01.355)

Hey everybody, today I have two fabulous comedy creators with me. I have Suchandrika Chakrabarti and Nerine Skinner. And I’m going to be talking to them about creating topical comedy, which is such a fun area to explore. And to introduce them a little bit, Suchandrika is a standup and also return guest of the show. I had her back on the podcast in season one, I think it’s episode three. And so much has happened since then. She runs the monthly night Good News, Bad News in North London. he writes for BBC One’s Have I Got News For You? And she’s going to be returning to the Edinburgh Fringe Festival this year with her second solo show, Doomscrolling, which we touched on in our first episode and she has been doing so much with since then. And also making joint work. So we’re going to dive into that soon, but also, I can’t begin without letting you know this fun fact that Suchandrika shared that actually she was asked to be on the first season of the popular TV show The Traitors and she turned it down. So Nerine I’m going to introduce you in a moment, but I can’t just brush over that. What happened? How were you asked? Why did you turn it down? Tell me all the things.

Suchandrika (01:06.76)

Ha ha! So I got an email and it was just, I was being asked to audition. So I think for the first season of the Traitors, it was like an open casting call. Anyone, I think in the country, probably, probably UK, could apply to audition. But I think they were looking possibly for comedians, cause like we could sort of get up and go and we used to just talking to people, possibly, you know, certain demographics they wanted. But I just got the email and I was just like,I don’t want to do reality TV, it sounds like a nightmare. They’re like, you get to live in a Scottish castle for two weeks. Some people are traitors, some people are faithfuls, there’s a cash prize. And I was like, absolutely not. I’ll be this generation’s nasty Nick. It will all go wrong, I’ll get cancelled. And everybody’s like, yes, you will. And you will get cancelled. And I was just like, I was just not in a great head space. And I was just like, no. And so I said, oh, not for me, thank you. And I know from another comedian actually who got the same email, I think, that she did audition or had an interview, but then they didn’t come back to her afterwards. So, yeah. So, I mean, it could have gone very right or very wrong. And then people obviously, the response to most people is, did you go back to the second series? They don’t respond to my emails now because they don’t need to. I think part of that mistake perhaps has led to the show that Nerine and I want to make right what once went wrong.

Danielle (02:37.853)

Yeah. And I can’t wait to dive into the show and it is related to The Traitors and also to something else that we’re going to pick up on when we introduce Nerine. So welcome Nerine Skinner too. Lovely to have you joining the show. Nerine is an actress, comedian, deviser, improviser extraordinaire. She recently went viral with her Liz Truss parodies that have received millions of views on YouTube and also is going to relate to the work that we’re going to talk about soon. So very fun.

Interestingly, she is a Funny Women Awards finalist. Shout out to Lynne Parker, who we had on the show, who’s the founder of Funny Women. And Nerine is a finalist for content creators, which is fabulous. And also she reached the semifinals of Britain’s Got Talent with her comedy cabaret trio, The Dots, which…I just watched a clip online and I was like, how did I miss this? This is so fun. And Nerine will also be going to the Edinburgh Festival this year with her solo show, which she’ll be debuting. So, so much to ask about as it relates to making work and particularly topical comedy. But what I want to start with is your joint project. Such a fun concept for listeners. Could you tell us a little bit about what that concept is and how it came about? And I’ll throw that to either of you.

Nerine Skinner (03:55.503)

Yes, well thank you so much firstly for having me on the show. It’s really lovely to be here. It’s Nerine by the way, just in case you’re confused about which voice you’re hearing. Yeah, so I… Well, we met, both of us met on… It was on Good News, Bad News, wasn’t it? That’s how we met, wasn’t it?

Suchandrika (04:12.68)

Yeah, so we were kind of aware of each other online, I think we’ve been at the same fringe festivals. You get to know everyone’s face and poster and you see them on Instagram, you see them online. And then it was the day that Liz Truss had announced that book, 10 years to Save the West. Incredible. And because the mixed bill night is very topical, I just thought I’d message Nereine because I don’t know, we had a good feeling about each other, didn’t we? And I was like, Oh, would you want to come down and and do like a bit and I’ll interview you about the book and it’ll just be fun. And Nerine lives just slightly outside London, but sort of said, I’ll come back in and do this. And we sort of did a little improv. You know, when you have good chemistry with somebody, you know when it works and like your Liz, I mean, the impression was great, I already knew that, but like your Liz is so, is not a pushover. Like there was a lot to work with and we went for like 10 minutes and we literally just met. So that felt like a good sign to me. Definitely. That was really fun.

Nerine Skinner (05:09.807)

Yeah. It was really lovely because it just like you say, I think it’s very rare when you kind of meet someone and you get on immediately with having not known them. But like you say, having that social presence, but because I’d been doing so much of the Liz stuff, and then you’d also been doing Claudia or like the idea around that and you told the story about The Traitors and what you just explained and it was a near miss and it was so popular at the time that we just felt like there was this world where we could merge the two together and create a really fun whodunit show with Liz Truss and loads of different characters that don’t necessarily even have to be political. So it seemed like a too good thing to miss really.

Danielle (05:43.051)

So many things I want to ask you about. But I’m going to start with, like you mentioned it’s a whodunit show now and it’s in the form that you’re currently working on. So I’m curious,  how much you’re thinking about how you’re trying to structure it for the audience and the interactivity and where you’re kind of leaving space for, like you’ve both talked about the improvisation element. Where are you currently in what that balance looks like?

Suchandrika (06:20.296)

Really discussing it. Yeah.

Nerine Skinner (06:20.655)

I think, yeah, exactly that. It feels like we keep discussing it, don’t we? And then changing our mind, which is always a natural process with any creative element. But I don’t know if you would agree, it seems like we’ve now got a sense of, okay, everyone does their little bit, which they can control. They know what that is. So they’re presenting something to the audience, which is almost their case as to why they were not responsible for the downfall of the economy or can plead their case. So there’s a section that’s quite structured and then the second half will lead to the audience being able to ask questions. I think that’s where we’re at. Am I wrong? Have I got it all wrong? Probably.

Suchandrika (07:03.528)

Yeah, no, it’s that kind of thing that you want everyone to shine and have loads of fun and do the improv. And then you want the audience to feel like they’re participating. I think there’s something about the interactivity that makes live performance really exciting for audiences. Like maybe in sort of a grim time where the cost of living crisis, I think is biting even harder than ever. To really get people out and show them a really fun time. Yeah, we just want the audience to be part of it.

Like, with Good News/ Bad News when the audience talks back, it’s not quite the way, because they’re really nice audiences, but they’re often really politically engaged. They’re often really very knowledgeable, but like when they just come along to have fun and be silly, I think that’s where there’s the best energy in the room. And so we’re just trying to, yeah, try and recreate that with this sort of like semi -improvised, semi -structured game. It’s an experiment.

People like the concept, which is fun. People laugh when they hear the concept and we just want to keep that sort of feeling going, I suppose.

Nerine Skinner (07:59.151)

I think. Yeah, it’s also interesting that I was discussing this with another comedian recently about everyone’s interest in the short term, like you’ve only got a couple of minutes to impress. I think because people are watching so many TikToks and Reels that are 20 seconds or less, that the interactive element seems to be becoming even more and more important and necessary in theatre or comedy. So to be able to have…it seems like loads of murder mysteries are blowing up at the moment and they’re very fun. So to be able to mix a bit of the politics with the fun of The Traitors and the reality TV with that interactive, it feels like it could be a really fun thing that is engaging for everyone.

Danielle (08:52.363)

Hmm. Yeah, that makes total sense. And I want to ask, and it’s not a super easy question, but where do you, where are you getting your fuel for the topical element and in a way that doesn’t just drive you mad? I mean, so this might be my own projection of thinking about trying to deal with social media and different things, but what are you using as the sources for that topical element and how are you managing that relationship in terms of still being a creator and still being able to kind of go about your day without feeling fried. We touched on this a little bit with Doomscrolling Suchandrika, back in the first show. So I’ll ask you first, Suchandrika.

Suchandrika (09:34.888)

Yeah, I suppose that I love the news is a really odd thing to say. What I find I’ve always been able to do with the news is like find the ridiculous in it. And the ridiculous, I mean, to be honest, a lot of what drives me with Topical Comedy is rage, is like, this is wrong, what’s happening. This is a terrible government. There are so many things happening, because of cuts that shouldn’t be happening, people are suffering, people should have their dignity. So it’s actually like absolute fury, but I can’t get on stage and rant. That’s just not… I think people shut down. I don’t think that’s my style. But I think when you make people laugh, even if people believe different things, it just changes the atmosphere. They’re more willing to be open. They might not change their mind, but I think they’re more willing to listen. And so that really drives me is to try and get past division or tribalism when it comes to politics.

And I find the facts, to be honest, this particular government has come up with so many absurd characters that I think the only way to go is to push it further and make it more surreal and more ridiculous. Because otherwise it just feels like a lesson in the news and I don’t think people want that. I think they’re very tired, they’re switching off from the news. And so I see topical stuff as a shorthand, like Liz Truss as a type of… You can take Liz Truss as.. what you’re presenting to me is this terrible person who tanked the economy fine. Or you can see her as a type or type of Tory, or like people can see her as a character or her as a theme or her as a symptom. If you do it in comedy, as opposed to doing it really straight. So I’d say that for me is like, yeah,  I think things should be different. I feel that very strongly, but the only way I feel I can get that across.

without sermonizing is comedy. So that drives me. Not a gentle, very heavy answer there, but it’s just the truth.

Danielle (11:38.635)

I know, but that’s, yeah, no, that’s helpful. That’s what we want is just the truth. And how about for you Nerine? So I was asking about the fuel of it and how you kind of manage that relationship with whatever it is, where you get your news from.

Nerine Skinner (11:53.103)

Yeah, well for me, I’ve come from it from a slightly different angle, I think, because I actually used to steer away from politics in my comedy because I didn’t feel like I ever really knew enough about it. And I found that it was, well, it is so hard to keep up with it. Every day there’s something new. And so I steered away from it. And then it was just Liz Truss that made me kind of go down that direction because I was interested in her from, like you were saying, Suchandrika, about her character. That’s what really drew me in.

So I always look at characters first and see what or who they remind me of. And that’s my impetus for then creating something. So I’m less of… I think probably my own insecurities of not feeling like I still know enough about the political world that if I go at it from that angle, so I’ll wait for something to inspire me, but equally it’s very difficult because like I say, it’s hard to keep up with everything that’s going on and…even when I think, oh, I’m going to do something on this particular situation that’s happened. By the time I’ve gone to film it, something else has happened. Something new has happened.

So I think what’s quite useful for our show in particular is holding onto things that we know particularly maybe about Liz. For instance, she loves cheese. She loves pork. All the things that maybe the wider majority of people do know that they can relate to about her that even if we have to add in new stuff, because the news has moved on, that we have those to bring it back to a stable place that people can relate to because not every…that’s what I’m realising, is that not everyone knows the intricacies of these characters. It’s only from when we’ve done the research on them. So you forget sometimes if people aren’t so political, that they might not know. So it’s nice to have general moments within it as well.

Danielle (13:42.987)

Yeah, that’s really good advice. And I want to ask both of you about character comedy as well and where it fits with that. So I’m going to ask about the Liz Truss piece first. Any tips for people who maybe like they are interested in a particular character that’s in the news, but they are kind of nervous of doing that because maybe they don’t consider that they’re an impersonator or they haven’t actually tried that before. Any tips for kind of…grounding something or making something work when it is a real life person that people can look at footage of and may see in the news. I’ll ask Nerine first and then we’ll come on to Claudia Winkleman. Yeah.

Suchandrika (14:19.56)

Hehehe

Nerine Skinner (14:20.175)

It’s a really good question because I remember when I first started I felt really out of my depth because my friend actually said I should do it as a joke and then it blew up overnight. But I think that if you’ve got something that you’re intrigued by that just to do it and you know you can just see what happens because even if you don’t feel overly that confident, it could be the key to opening something else.

And if it is a particular character, just looking at their mannerisms or the way that they speak. What I’ve learned is I would never really necessarily call myself an impressionist. I just happen to look a bit like Liz in the first instance and the voice and everything has come over time, but it’s wildly exaggerated. And I wouldn’t say I’m as close to any of the other characters that I do as I am to her. So I would say I’m more of a parodist. And I think that that’s a really lovely thing that people…I would encourage people to do is if you find something that inspires you, even if you sound nothing like them, it could just be an observation that you’ve picked up, or even the way that they move their eyes, that could be really funny to someone because they hadn’t realized that they’d picked up upon that observation. So yeah, just go for it, I think, and not worry. And try not to do what I do and get stuck because I ended up just becoming Liz Truss. So I now need to find other characters.

Danielle (15:44.491)

Okay, yeah, that makes sense. And yes, for all kinds of reasons, I love it. And Suchandrika I’d love to ask you as well, like character comedy, your experience with it, what’s drawn you to it, what’s been fun. I’ve seen pictures online of you as Claudia Winkleman.

suchandrika (15:46.202)

Hehehehe. What we’ve started with is the harrowing story of how Nerine has become Liz and it is terrifying so give it a go but when will it end? When will it end? I’m so sorry to make this even worse for you Nerine but I started getting into character comedy I suppose like how did I begin? What was I doing? To be fair I do think in stand-up I’ve always been playing a character but I haven’t been telling anyone I was doing it and…this kind of aunt character. Like my very first set ever, which I did at the end of the course I did at the Bill Murray back in 2020. I was giving advice about dating to my niece who was three or four at the time. And so it was a fun concept to like give this wildly inappropriate. When I say inappropriate, I mean, I was speaking from the standpoint of somebody who listens to true crime podcasts. So I was like, they’re all murderers. This is how you watch out for a murderer on a date. And it’s funny cause it’s like, too much to tell a child. But also it’s so far from what I would ever say to her. This is a character. Why am I not? Because I had an idea of what I’d be as a standup and I was like, I’ve come from journalism. I’m really straight, factual, microphone. And I think, you know, as Nerine has said, like you should give things a go and allow yourself to break out of that box that maybe you’ve put yourself in. Oh, I’m only allowed to be this kind of comic because I’ve come from here. Well, nobody’s saying that.

So it’s actually, I think I’m playing characters. I think this persona is so far from me. Number one, I should tell people because they might think that is me. But also, like, what is she saying to her niece? But also like, I’m not an actor, I’m not trained. And so I definitely feel that anxiety about, about trying to sort of play in the same playground as people who are. But then something about this show that I’m so glad I have Nerine to do this with me is that, and I know she’ll be like, no, but like….You want someone who does a really good impression the way you do your parody. I like what you said about parodies. I think that’s that’s right. But you do capture something about Liz and the way she talks and holds her head that is so correct. I’ve not seen someone do it better. And then my Claudia Winkleman is terrible. And that’s fine. I think when you’ve got someone who’s good and we’ve got other people in the cast who are good as well. I think the show has to have this, but I think it raises it a level when you’ve got people who’ve got those skills and can do it really well. My Claudia is a wig with too much fringe and I’ve got, we’ve got some hoods and I think that it makes it funnier that mine’s not good. All my characters basically with a wig on and one whale mask. And I’m not, I can’t do, I have an Elmo. I try to do an Elmo voice. Someone was like lean in to the Elmo voice more. So I’ll try. But I think my character comedies almost meta in terms of I know I’m bad at it. And so I’m kind of like, I’m doing this for my nieve. And that’s what Doomscrolling has become that I’m like trying out character comedy in the show. I don’t….I tease people with it and like don’t put on the props until late. And yeah, I think it makes it funnier that my Claudia is just a woman who’s basically trying to fully cover herself with hair. And nothing else. I can’t do the voice. I can’t do anything, but I think you don’t need that much from Claudia because, I remember Noreen retweeted the picture of us from the market show. And someone said, Oh, is that Claudia Winkleman? Like, yeah, is that a version of Claudia Winkleman. It’s great people are getting it. That’s all you want.

So I think we had this conversation…Someone said to me, I can’t remember who, it’s like, if they’re thinking they’re not laughing. And I think that’s a huge problem with topical comedy. And a huge problem with the way I write, which is often like 25 ideas in one sentence. And yeah, like I’ve always been like that. And so if someone’s already visual, like for me, I’ve learned a lot more about visual comedy and physical comedy. So now when I go up to stage, I’m five foot three, often the mic is a bit higher because you know, lots of men on lineups and…I’m not tall. And so instead of asking them to move it for me, I’ll go and be like, Oh, oh, oh. And like, just, just do that. And just, if you can get a laugh without opening your mouth, that just builds that rapport already. And I think that’s such a gift that people who sort of know about physical comedy and character comedy, they already have that. And then landing endings as well. I’m wondering if growing into a character in the show, so letting people see me do that, if that’s getting a good laugh. And yes, that’s where I am with it.

I don’t know if I’ll ever be much good at character comedy, but it can get a lot without me having scripted a line. And that for me feels like a good way. So I’m improvising a lot more and doing character and having a lot of fun with it really. Yeah.

Danielle (20:32.555)

That does sound so fun. And I love that you both think so honest about it. Clearly you both have like such strengths that you’re bringing from your different background. And that’ll be true for all listeners. So whether it’s like from journalism and all the massive skill set that goes into that and that relationship with politics or whether it’s training in theatre and comedy. But then we always, as humans, look at the bits of like… but I don’t have that, I may have that. So maybe I shouldn’t, you know, I’m not a journalist, I’m not this. So it’s lovely to kind of hear that that’s true for everybody and we’re all kind of bringing that to it. And how fun to make a joint collaborative project where you get to share that. And also you’re having guests on the show, I believe. Could you say a little bit more about that? Because I think that sounds very fun. What’s that going to be like? How are you going to manage those relationships?

Nerine Skinner (21:18.383)

We’ve got a selection of guests and the idea is that each of them will come on and present their case. So they’ll get a good five to 10 minutes each. And what’s really lovely about it is because they’re all really very different in their skill sets. So like we were just talking about that we know that they’re gonna bring something amazing to it. We may have more than one Liz Truss. We may have more than one Nadine Dorries.

And the good thing is because everybody’s so versatile that we’ve kind of left it open at the moment that they can discover, they might want to be one character, they might want to play two characters, or maybe they might just want to get up and do some standup, or maybe for some reason there’s a non-political character that just pops up who has nothing to do with the night but is there. Or some songs as well, because everyone…is so, like I was saying, versatile and they’ve got people who can sing really well or improvise sing really well. So I feel like it is going to be a really fun night full of very different styles. And I think that’s always really interesting for the audience and keeping their attention span as well.

Danielle (22:35.403)

Yeah, which is a real thing. So yeah, so I love that you’re engaging with that. And do you mind me asking how you selected those people? Because there’ll be listeners at all different points in their career, some in the UK, some in the US or different kinds of environments. But like, is that from people that you know from other comedy nights that you’ve done, relationships you built online? Like, how are you sort of selecting those people? If I could ask that to Suchandrika.

Nerine Skinner (22:38.063)

Yes!

Suchandrika (23:01.384)

Yeah, all of these things. We haven’t announced people on social media yet, but we will. Yeah, people I’ve gigged with, people I kind of have an online relationship with and I’ve seen their work, but I haven’t necessarily worked with them. Have I even in real life met everyone? Possibly not one person, but I’m still aware of what they do.

Lots of improvising, like I think that’s what we really wanted and thought like they’d have the most fun is people who are very happy to get up and not be scripted, but just bring their own stuff. People who make me laugh as well, people who I enjoy their comedy and would love to be around and work with them. So yeah, I think both of us sort of like discussing people, but really landing on like, we had the same ideas of people who are like, yes, yes, yes, yes, it’s got to be them. And…then just hoping they were free and wanted to do it. So I think we’ve been quite lucky with him. So yeah, it’s worked out.

Danielle (24:06.859)

Perfect. And not necessarily an easy question, but is there anything that you feel is sort of off limits in terms of, because you want, you know, you’ve talked about it being really fun and fun for the audience too. Are there any conversations that you’ve had behind the scenes about things where you’re like, that’s just off limits or it might not have come up, or is it really just about how it’s dealt with, just in terms of what you’re prepared to draw on from a topical comedy and the kind of things that happen in the news. If that’s possible to even answer that question.

Nerine Skinner (24:38.447)

It’s a really good point actually because we haven’t had that conversation. So thank you, Danielle, because we can have it now. I don’t know actually, is there?

Suchandrika (24:49.352)

So I, I take a lot of my experience from Good News, Bad News. I know it’s not the same kind of night, but it’s, it’s kind of like hosting and having lots of different people along. And with obviously with that kind of theme where I say, bring along a new story from the last month and just say the headline and have a reaction. That’s kind of minimum all the way up to if you’ve got like a really newsy set, you know, all new material, it’s all good. But I kind of go with trust that they’re not going to get into a new story that is impossible to make comedy about, like, certain wars going on in the world. And I haven’t had to say anything. I think that’s partly because I’m not looking for the quote unquote sort of edgy comedians. I don’t know any of them personally. It’s not my style of comedy. I’m really more looking for people who’ve got an inventive approach to things.

Yeah, and I’ve not seen many people on the circuit kind of try to do jokes about really serious things going on in the world right now. I think people do understand. I feel like the people we work with aren’t trying to shock. There is that kind of comedy and I find I work much more with, you can call it more gentle humour if you want, but actually people can still get dark and get ridiculous, but I think it’s more, I love like a surreal kind of approach. And yeah, I’ve, I had that in my head. Like, should I be saying this to people? Like keeping it within limits or like, but I’ve not, and no one has sort of gone over the bounds of taste in my opinion. And no one’s complained to me or anything.

So I’ve been running Good News, Bad News since last November. I do think people have a strong sense of what could be joked about and what is helpful to joke about as well. Really current serious situations just aren’t funny. You could say this of a current political situation, it’s not the same thing, but I think there’s a resistance involved when we laugh at our powerful political leaders. That’s our form of resistance and that’s…something we’re existing within. And so we, we have a stake in the society and we can laugh. It’s not the same as the serious wars going on in the world. That’s what it’s felt like to me. I’ve never had to say anything. Also don’t feel anyone’s even tried to make those sorts of jokes that the nights have run.

Danielle (28:01.451)

Yeah. And that probably says a lot for how you’re hosting the event as well and the environment that you’re setting up and the tone that you’re setting as a leader in that space, which is awesome. And, sorry, I want to come back to you in a second Nerine. But I wanted to ask you one follow -up question about the Good News, Bad News, Suchandrika, just because you have been doing it and you have been seeing all these other comics come through and participating in that evening. And I don’t know if it’s even possible to say, but without naming names, just like on a sort of birds eye view level, are there any particular things you think you’ve learned from watching all those different people and how they’ve treated topical comedy that you think, oh, that’s a really good idea or hmm, I might avoid that. Or is that hard to say because everyone has their own different styles?

Suchandrika (28:44.904)

I really like having a lot of different styles. Something I thought was really fun was somebody came along and they did personal good news and bad news. And I thought it was a really fun twist. The audience really liked it. It fit with their persona who was like an anxious millennial kind. It could be them as well, but I felt like it was a persona. And I thought that was very cute. And I’ve suggested that to people. People sometimes get worried about topical comedy. And one thing I really want the night to be is like a complete sandbox. I want any comedian who I’m asking to be part of it or who’s approached me to feel there isn’t a bar to get into this night. Like it’s playtime. It’s fun. So if you’re worried about the topical stuff, like literally just name it, name a news headline. Or I do a really topical intro when I MC. I name loads of news stories or I do a character. Cruella Braverman.

I was Captain Tom’s daughter for a long time. Again, it’s not about going in on her because she’s a private individual. She’s not elected to public office, but there’s something that really captures the image. She’s very memorable. I think my favourite thing is she’s a PR, but she has a terrible public image. And I think that’s just very human. I think if you go in and you’re going, you’re finding the human thing. So she’s Captain Tom’s daughter, but what I’m actually joking about is this person who’s got themselves wrong. And so then in my interpretation, she’s now trying to become a comedian and then she writes jokes with ChatGPT.

So you just, you take the human thing about them and remove it from them. And then it’s not really about joking about her. So yeah, I think, I think from watching other people, I’ve learned a lot more about like find that emotion, maybe find the relatable human thing in them. And you can remove that from the person in the headlines who’s naturally been reduced to just like one or two qualities.

And also the use of music, I find if your character has entrances, changes, exits…how you use music to kind of keep the audience going when there’s dead air, quote unquote dead air. That’s been great to watch and that’s taught me a lot. And yeah, just getting a laugh without saying anything. I’m always, I love watching that and thinking, how can I, how could I use that basically? But there’ve been so many great acts come through, like it’s been a joy to run this night. It’s really fun.

Danielle (31:05.643)

Oh, so many great tips in there. I love it. And Nerine, sorry I interrupted you. Is there anything that you wanted to add? And if not, no problem. I’ll ask you another question.

Nerine:

Oh, no, I think it was just off the back of you saying about characters and things you can’t touch upon as such. I think you kind of just said it there. I think when I’m looking at characters, I try and just look at the mannerisms or look at a situation and I never do it with bad intent towards the person because I always realise that ultimately whatever is going on that they’re a human and everyone has their own things and we never know what is happening behind closed doors or whatever, regardless. So I’m always really aware of that. And I think that most, I feel like, I don’t know if you feel this too, but I feel like most people, most comedians have that intention of awareness and especially if it’s character stuff.

I almost feel like you can hide behind a character more sometimes so that actually you can get away with more, especially controversial stuff. And if you are, if you have got a message that is underneath and you feel passionate, that you want to get that across, it’s much easier. I’ve got a conspiracy theorist character that I’ve got there who isn’t political at all, but because he talks like that, and he can just say what he wants, he can just say what he wants and it’s controversial. But if I was to say that as me, I’d probably get shut away somewhere. But there’s something about that freedom which I think is really nice for an audience as well to explore their own, how they feel about something without it being necessarily out in the open and obvious. So I think that helps the whole thing.

Danielle (32:52.875)

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Fabulous. So many things I’d love to ask you about this project, but I also want to ask you about your Edinburgh shows before we wrap up too, because you’re both going to Edinburgh Festival this year. I’d love to know what that sort of preparation process is looking like currently, if anything, and any tips. Because I’ve heard from multiple listeners actually who listen to the show, both in the UK and in the US, who haven’t been to Edinburgh and are considering it and kind of want to know more about it and are interested in that in episodes.

So I’d love to start with you, Suchandrika, because you’’ve already been to Edinburgh. What’s it looking like now, the preparation process and anything that you’re kind of thinking of as we are in May, 2024, looking forward.

Suchandrika (33:35.208)

Yeah, so this is my second show I’m taking up and I debuted, took up my first comedy show in August 2022, did the whole month. Glad I did it. And I think just going, turning up with the show, it’s like a big shop window. People will come and see you. It will lead to things in your career. It’s great. It’s a great thing to do. This time around, obviously the accommodation has just skyrocketed in terms of price in Edinburgh. So I’m doing two weeks.The last two weeks, I’m not doing a full run. I’m with Hootenannies at Potterow. So for people who know the Fringe, they used to be the BlundaBus that sort of parked in the middle of Edinburgh, right by this underpass. And then you go into Bristol Square and you’ve got the Pleasance Dome and Underbelly and everything. And so they can’t have the bus anymore. There’s been sort of a law change. And so Hootenannies has taken over the sort of space and they’re going to have two yurts.

So I’m just going to be performing this big yurt by an underpass, which is the dream. And it’s great. It’s brilliant. And then basically, Hootenannies, one of the people who set it up, a guy called John Miller, he set up Monkey Barrel with some other people, I think. And so their thing is like a fair financial deal for artists, because you can pay a lot to be in, at the Fringe. And I certainly paid a lot more with my original venue. So basically the artists don’t pay up front, because right now you have a lot of Edinburgh bills coming in, and you’ve got instalments to pay for your venue and so on. And they basically take 20 % off your tickets at the end. And so that has made it much more affordable for me. And that’s something to think about for people who worry about the cost of the fringe. I’m trying to do it as cheaply as I can, because I’m in a worse financial position than I was two years ago. I think a lot of us are. And yeah, just really seeing where I go from there. And I’m much more, I’m sorry to say this in front of Noreen, but I’m much more relaxed because it’s my second go.

And there’s sort of this particular thing about debuting, which I’m sure she can tell you about, which is a bit more pressure. For me, I feel the show is written now and it’s just a case of like doing it and learning it obviously. And I’ll tweak it. I think it’s taken me also two years to get here. So I didn’t go in 2023. I think it’s really important to note because there’s this feeling you have to go every year, possibly some pressure. I don’t have an agent or anyone like that. Nobody’s telling me to go to Fringe. Nobody needs me there. It’s fine. I’m choosing to go. But I’ve taken two years and it’s felt right for my show and for my mental health and for my finances. And that’s sort of what’s worked for me. I don’t think I’m the only person to do that. And it’s something to think about just like, can you take the pressure off a bit, particularly if it’s not your first show and just make it easier on yourself? And I think I have done as much as I can to make it easier and a bit more fun. But I’d say Nernie’s is the more interesting story because she’s debuting and that’s what a lot of people worry about. So over to you.

Danielle (36:27.787)

Yeah, that’s really helpful advice and very wise, I’m sure provides great comfort to people. There can be that pressure to be there every year. So great to kind of hear that more balanced view of it.

Suchandrika (36:42.984)

I think it’s unsustainable these days. I think it was doable 10 years ago, maybe. I’ve been going as a member of the audiences since 2003 and accommodation. But the accommodation has rocketed. Yeah, it’s so much money that I have to think as well, like what can the audience afford and sort of all the other people who are working like techs, flyers, all of them, how are they affording it? And so it’s not, what has this become? So yeah, it’s unsustainable. Every other year is pretty good enough for me while it lasts. So.

Danielle (37:23.179)

Yeah, I love it. And Nerine, I’d love to hear your take too.

Nerine Skinner (37:28.463)

Yeah, so I mean, I’ve been to Edinburgh Fringe as part of the trio, the Dots and also my Franks and Skinner duo. So I do I know it. But like you were saying, the idea of going there as a debut, the pressure and not only financially, because it’s so expensive, as you were saying, because at least before I was, oh, yes, of course, we were splitting it in half or three ways. So it took that level out. And we also had we were fortunate in those past years that we just happened to have got a good deal because maybe the venue thought that it wasn’t going to do very well at that time. I think when I did Franks and Skinner, my comedy duo, we did a show at 11am and they presumed that nobody would come. But actually it was the perfect time because people didn’t have any other shows that were competing and we were offering tea and biscuits. So that was lovely.

Danielle (38:19.275)

Nice.

Nerine Skinner (38:25.263)

I’m a very indecisive person. So this process has been quite tricky because me trying to make a decision about where would I do it, which venue, what image should I use? There’s so many decisions to make and they all feel highly pressured because I sort of feel like I want to give this one my all, you know, even if that means that, I don’t know, it doesn’t go as well or it goes really well, trying to take that layer off, but just giving it my all, which means that…

I was saying the other day, this week, I’ve really found that the admin of it takes up so much time, whether that’s a press release or all the other festivals that you’re doing for Work in Progress is to get there, that sometimes the actual show and the content then takes a back seat. And that’s my process at the moment is trying to find a balance between getting the show ready, getting the admin ready and then also trying to work to earn the money that I need. So it is really stressful.

But at the same time, for anyone who’s listening and thinking about it, I think it’s such a, if you can and there’s a way and there are probably, there are ways of doing it. You know, like Suchandrika was saying, you know, you can maybe do it on a cheaper way or however that works for you. I think it’s an experience that you’ll get so much from that regardless it’s…

even if you just do it the once or whatever, I’m really looking forward to what that brings and what that feels like when I’m there. So yeah, I’m excited about it. It doesn’t sound like it, but I am.

Danielle (39:59.723)

Yeah, no, that’s great. And this is the show where people want to know all the real details as well as…. like you wouldn’t be doing it unless you wanted to. So we know there’s a huge love for the comedy there. And you’ve also talked in such a fun way about your Traitors project too. So many things I’d love to ask you, but we’re coming up to time. So before we wrap up, is there anything else that we’ve missed that people should really know about you and your work? And if not, where can we go to find out more?

And obviously I’ll put these links in the show notes and starting with Suchandrika.

Suchandrika (40:31.272)

Oh, about me and my work. My show, Doomscrolling, it’s me kind of speaking to my niece who’s five or six and trying to make sense of this current time. So if that is something you’re into, come along. I’m getting lots of parents bringing like 11 to 13 year olds, which I find fascinating. And they’ve been quite good audience members. So I’ll say like stuff I think their generation’s doing and then I’ll check with them. They’ll be like, yeah, I’d never have like a public instagram account. I’m like, yeah, yeah, because you’re much better at the internet than we are. Yeah, yeah. So that’s fun. I’ve actually put it as a 12 years plus because it’s at 3pm. So I’m open to the people bringing youths and I’ll just deal with them being young. But yeah, so do you have a link? You have a link, I’m sure. And come to the Liz Truss’ the Traitors, our show at Aces and Eights in North London on the 29th of May. You’ll have the link, I’m sure. It’ll be very fun.

Danielle (41:27.083)

Oh well, so I put both of those in. Amazing. And Nerine.

Nerine Skinner (41:31.151)

Yeah, I suppose just the same, my show in Edinburgh is about me being sort of as Liz Truss and trying to find ways, what do I do next? And being an indecisive person, I look at my childhood, explore that and use my other non-political characters to help me try and remove her from inside me, which is a strange sentence. So yes, that’s on Just the Tonic venues at 2.40.

Danielle (41:40.555)

Hmm.

Nerine Skinner (41:55.695)

And you can find all about me at Nerine Skinner on all of the socials. It’s a weird spelling, N -E -R -I -N -E. It’s a very unusual name. So I don’t mind if anyone calls me a different name. And yes, come to Liz Truss’ the Traitors on the 29th. It’s gonna be a really, really, really fun one.

Danielle (42:15.019)

Oh, fabulous. Thank you so much today. So much I’ve learned and have to think about as we go our separate ways. And I hope you have tons of fun on the 29th and also in Edinburgh. Bye for now.