Danielle Krage:

Hey, everyone, I’m very lucky to have the multi talented Holly Hall with me today. Holly is an actor, comedian, writer, and improviser. So I have loads of questions for her. She actually won the B B C. New Comedy Awards Digital comedian of the year in 2021with her super funny sketch ‘When podcasts go wrong’, and because of that, she was then given a commission by the BBC to create a short film ‘It’s what she would have wanted’ which I have watched and it’s  so brilliant and hilarious. I’ll include links to that in the show notes. She’s also currently performing a new solo comedy show, ‘You wouldn’t like me when I’m angry’. So as you can tell, there’s so much expertise that Holly has that I’m going to grill her about today. Holly. I’m going to ask you first of all about character, because you are such a great writer-performer. I’d love to know what are some of the sort of tips and techniques that you find helpful when you’re creating your central character, And then I will come on to ask about how you think about writing for other characters too.

Holly:

Yeah, so I think if anyone’s looking to create a character a great way of doing it, and something that I definitely do is to take inspiration from your own life, or to kind of like, just observe the people that are around you. Whether that’s eavesdropping on someone’s conversation or whether it’s a really funny person that you work with. I think that can be a really great way to create character to start with. Or maybe they just give you an idea and then you build it from there. I would say I think that’s how I go about it. Or alternatively, if your story is a very personal story, then maybe you can base it around yourself.

Danielle Krage:

Really good tips. So I’m going to have to ask you, for your sketch, ‘When podcasts go wrong’… Where did you get the idea for that from? Because anyone who’s listening to or watching this right now, I can tell you that in a horribly ironic twist of fate, this is actually my second time trying to record Holly. The first time this week I had a power cut. The lights went out. Everything went out. And I left Holly stranded on the other side. So I’d love to know Holly, for that award winning sketch. How did you get that idea? And what do you think people are responding to when they watch it?

holly:

So the initial idea came from me listening to some really bad podcasts, these like…American motivational podcasts, And there was one in particular that I was listening to that just seemed to be the host talking about how he was going to make you feel motivated for the entire podcast. And then there were zero motivational tips.And then it was just adverts, so just listening to it like ‘when is he gonna motivate me?’ seems really mad. So that was my initial idea and then I went to my friend Dipak Patel, who is a writer and director and just said ‘I’ve got this idea. What do you think?’ And then he is incredible at creating comedy sketches. So good at structure as well. So he kind of developed that idea with me. It was his idea to come up with the internal external dialogue that the character has, And so yeah, just it was a collaborative process going back and forth and I think what people can relate to, even if you don’t have a podcast… I think people can relate to just like the feeling of embarrassment when you’ve done something wrong, but you don’t want to admit to the fact that you’ve done something wrong. And you maybe just try and live with it a little bit… like it’s a really uncomfortable thing to sit in and live in, but I don’t know. Maybe not. I think, probably in real life we don’t do it to that extent, But sometimes you do want to get away with something and just see how far you can take it.

Danielle Krage:

Yeah, I think that’s perfect.

Do you mind talking a little bit about it in relation to your short film? How you then thought about extending to that ten minute piece? Because I absolutely love the escalation in your short film. , The way that the tension mounts and where we arrive at by the end, How did you think about approaching that for your character and structuring it to really create that amount of tension for ten minutes

Holly:

So it was a BBC commission, But I worked with Daddy Super Yacht and we developed the idea together. The initial idea came from me sharing embarrassing stories and I think they were like trying to pull this idea from the sketch of sitting in this kind of embarrassment and cringe kind of situation. And how can we like find other examples of that? So yeah, we had a lot of Conversations about embarrassing stories that have happened to me. It seems for some reason like I have had my first share of those. So then we were like…. Okay, what’s the situation where someone wants to get as much out of it as they possibly can? Being quite selfish, quite narcissistic, but also I don’t know. Like, maybe, sort of grounded to start with, and then escalating  to these other places.

Danielle Krage:

Yeah, I thought that was brilliant. How you did that. I loved how you started – I got the sense of like the kitchen table – really rooted in reality. And then where we arrived at by the end, the funeral was so funny to me. I thought you built it really expertly. Just jumping back to character, in relation to your short film…because I thought there was such a fantastic range of characters. I was thinking that even with that script, if you were one of those other performers, even if it was just three or four lines, they were so well drawn. There was so much that you could play with. How did you think about capturing that?

Holly:

I mean, I mean, yeah, I’d like to say a lot of it comes from the actors as well, like working with such a talented group of actors. I mean, you can create a great script, but ultimately the actors are part of that process once you get on set or once you get to rehearsals, so the writing is important, but I think what they each brought individually really created the characters that we had in the end. I think they were all very interesting, kind of weird quirky characters. I would say they’ve all got sort of weird elements to them. But yeah, it was just so impressive and amazing to see them all bring it to life. It was like when you’re writing it….hopefully you’re making yourself laugh when you’re writing it, but it’s nothing compared to seeing actors do it in real life.

Danielle Krage:

Oh that must be such a fun magical process. And did you have any say in the casting?

holly:

Yeah, quite a lot. I’d seen Kate Robins in after life. She plays like a psychic character and I just thought she’d be so funny for Annie’s mom. And I loved Smack the Pony when I was growing up, and just thought it would be a dream to have Fiona Allen play my mom. I thought we’re not a million miles away like it was quite a good casting for my mom in terms of looks, And then I’d met Kiell at the comedy awards, So I knew I really wanted to work with him, so that was amazing when he was up for it, And then yeah, I did get to meet some new actors as well, which was really really nice. So some I knew,  some I didn’t, some I’d seen their work and just thought they were incredible, So it was actually really lovely to get this amazing mix of people.

Danielle Krage:

It sounds like you’ve done a great job of building those network works, and you’ve mentioned lots of other creatives that you’ve worked with, whether it’s kind of bouncing ideas off each other as writers or as directors. For people that are sort of starting out and who may be able to access some of the amazing opportunities online right now, but are feeling perhaps a little bit isolated, trying to do things by themselves. What would you recommend practically… if it is someone  with their phone, in their bedroom, trying to make a start. What helped you build out that network of awareness? And actual working, collaborative relationships?

Holly:

So for me, I did a lot of Improv quite a few years ago, and that was really helpful for writing and for acting. I met a really great group of people and we then formed a team. Did a lot of shows in London. So I think I’ve met a lot of great people through Improv, and that’s been great, so I would recommend if anyone wants to get into comedy or like you say, is feeling a bit isolated, Improv is a great way to do that. And there were some really good schools. I don’t know about The rest of the U. K, but in London there’s the Free Association and Hooper, and a few of the great courses that are going on, so I’d say that’s a really good place to meet people as well. Because the likelihood is there are people there that would want to collaborate, maybe other writers or performers, so that would be something I would recommend. And then also, I would say, just filming things on your own, So that’s what I started doing in Lockdown, just filming short sketches. I’d say, try and make yourself laugh with it. Don’t worry too much about other people and how it’s going to be received to start with. Just think of funny things that you enjoy. Make them, put them out there. And I would say when you first start doing it, your friends and your family on social media, they’re going to be really supportive and want to see it and enjoy it. So that’s going to start you off, hopefully in a really supportive place, and then as you go on, you’ll hopefully make friends doing it. You will act with new people doing it. Tik Tok is amazing. A lot of the stuff that I’ve done has been through Instagram. Tik Tok obviously has blown up and it’s so amazing. Like when I first started putting videos on there… It’s amazing how many people watch your videos, even when you don’t have any like followers on there. It’s just such a huge audience. And I mean, I do post on Tiktok, but I feel like I’ve got a lot to learn and a lot to go through in terms of, you know, putting stuff out there on Tiktok. So yeah, I say, just being consistent with it is key. So maybe setting yourself a schedule of which days of the week you’re going to post, or how many times, thinking about content that you want to put out there. I mean, obviously, when you first start you don’t need to put too much pressure on yourself. but I think the real key to it is consistency.

Danielle Krage:

I think that’s really good advice. Great advice for anyone building any skill, so thank you for that.

I’d love to know how you deal with feedback… and that can be the whole gamut from potentially getting comments online, which may be very constructive, or may just be trolling… through to actually working professionally,for example, on your commission, If it’s gone through several layers of process. What are some of the practical ways that you think about either asking for feedback, receiving feedback, deciding what to take on board, deciding what to throw out? How have you calibrated that for yourself, as a really distinctive performer?

Holly:

I think I’ve got better at it over the years. There was probably a time where I found some feedback to be critical even when it wasn’t. Maybe that comes from a place when you’re first starting out. Or maybe you’re a bit scared and you’re a bit worried to put your work out there, so when you do get feedback you take it personally. But actually I think I’m okay with feedback. Now, as you go on, you’ll find people whose comedy you love or people who you really trust or admire, and if you’re getting notes from them, then that’s a great thing. They’re only going to give you things that are going to help and improve your work.

I’ve been doing a course recently where in the first session we had to give each other feedback and we’ve never met anyone in the room before, so we were sent like a sample of other people’s work, and then we just had to give feedback and it’s interesting. At first, we were all a bit timid and worried to say what we thought about it, but actually everyone can have an opinion and it can be useful to send your work to most people. I’d say, if there’s anyone in your life who is a kind of critical person, maybe protect yourself and don’t send it to them straight away. But I think everyone’s got something to give in terms of feedback, and I think most people just want to help you. They want you to do well, so I think if you come at it from that point of view, then it can only be helpful. And also, if you don’t agree with someone’s notes, maybe, just take a bit of time to think about it and think… Why do I not agree with them? And then yeah, I just think you don’t have to do everything everyone else says. Comedy is very subjective, So If someone gives you an idea or suggestion, you can consider it. But then if it’s not right for you, ultimately you can just say no… that’s good, but for this project I don’t think it’s right. Ao I think the more you do it, the more you’ll find your own kind of flow with it. I would say

Danielle Krage:

Yeah, I think that’s great advice. Because the more you do that with the consistency that you are speaking about, you do then get to calibrate and you accumulate enough for it not to be the one comment that you take completely out of context. I think that’s great, and also your suggestion of being in that Improv environment, whether you see yourself as a writer, or a writer-performer .That having to get up… and it’s not always going well… and having to bounce back from it, it does create that, sort of resilience, and openness, and play. And everyone wants you to be doing well.

Because you have got that Improv background, I’d love to know… Are there any specific tools from Improv that you just find really helpful? Like if you are stuck trying to generate something, or something isn’t working, or you’re trying to freshen something up? Are there any Improv tools that that you really love?

Holly:

Yeah, I think through doing scenes and Improv, you learn some of the basic rules like ‘Yes, and…’ and  supporting each other, trying to make each other look good. I think sometimes when you’re writing, if you’re a bit stuck, it can help, because if you’re right in a scene between two characters, rather than just staring at a blank page, you could just start improvising on your own and just imagining that you are both characters and just thinking…Well, what would they say? I think a really good thing to do as well is just… a lot of people talk about like writing a vomit draft. Anything that you’re writing. So I think aim to be bad on your first draft and just tell yourself this is going to be awful, but I’m going to write it and by the end of it, I’ll have a scene and then you can just rest it. Do something else. Come back to it and then you’ll be editing it and using that. So yeah, I think that’s good within Improv. I mean, I don’t know how much I use like, ‘Yes, and..’ when I’m writing. Maybe sometimes. But I mean for life, I think that’s quite a useful thing just for like general conversation. It is so good how much Improv can help with just regular life skills. Like listening, for example, like if you find yourself in a conversation or over multiple conversations, and you just think I, I’m not really listening to what they’re saying. I think Improv really helps with that because it can teach you the skills to just hone in on what the other person is saying.

Danielle Krage:

I think that’s perfect advice if you heard that in the background, my dog is very distracted by the fact that two guinea fowl have come and peered in through the window, so he’s trying to see them off…

Holly:

Oh no.

Danielle Krage:

…like they’re burglars. It’s fine. It’s only a guinea fowl alert, but yeah, I love…

Holly:

I thought he was just like, really passionate about Improv.

Danielle Krage:

Maybe we could also put that spin on it.  You can’t quite see him in the video, so let’s just say he was into it.

Yes, that’s also what I think. Improv is great for life. We all improvise. But actually I think that’s great because it also brings in that sense of play and that sense of openness… so vital.

I’d love to know,  for your solo that you’ve developed… how that that fits in, because again, I don’t know how long your show is? What timeframe you’re working with… but how you’ve built that? And how many iterations you’ve been through? What’s that process been like? From the idea that you started with. It’s called. ‘You wouldn’t like me when I’m angry’, which I love as a sort of thesis statement. What’s the process been like? From whatever the germ of that idea was through to where you are now.

Holly:

So I would say Improv has been hugely useful for that because when I first started it, it was during lockdown and I did a course that was part of the Cockpit theater, which is a really great course. I don’t know if they’re doing it at the moment, but they have it on their website. Basically,  there’s a lady named Daisy who runs in and she’s amazing, So yeah, it’s called. It was called ‘Get your show written’, so I spent time on that course. It was really great cause they’d give you… I really like it when you get set homework because it means you have to do it. Like there’s no just leave it… like it’s just me… like I don’t need to finish it. Now you’ve got someone who’s like ‘Right, on Tuesday I need you to present what you’ve got.’ So they would do things like, almost like a powerpoint presentation. It was over zoom and you would have to present your scenes for your show and obviously you hadn’t written them yet. It was just like ‘in this scene this will happen’. So I found that really useful And it went from that to then me basically typing out the whole show based on these scene ideas that I’d come up with, and when I then got to rehearsal, so my director is Chis Lindsay and I got to rehearsal, it wasn’t actually funny at all, because I just think because I’d just been spending so much time just writing it and not thinking about it as a performer. So what was really great about working with Chris and about having these Improv skills was he would just say ‘Right. So for this section we know this happens. Here’s the beats. Just improvise this.’ So then I would, in rehearsal improvise big sections, and then at the end of it he’d be like. ‘Right, Well, this worked’. Or he’d like laugh at a certain bit. and then I could go away and be like. ‘Right. Well, this scene. I’m going to write it up based on, you know, the feedback that Chris has given me all, like on the recording.’ Like If he laughed at a certain point, I’d be like ‘Great. Put that in and all the other bits. I can just cut it away.’ So yeah, I think if you’re struggling, especially if you’re a performer, you want to perform something you want to have a show, but you’re not necessarily a writer, Improv is a brilliant tool because you can just use that to make your show. You can just transcribe it from the audio.

Danielle Krage:

I think that’s fantastic advice And did it…were you at all…when you stood up and you kind of felt like, ‘Oh, it’s not funny’ Did that worry you at all or not? In the sense that there’s so many pieces now that we’re putting all different labels on, like comedy-drama, there’s so much that’s contained within it. And maybe that initial part for you is finding the character of finding what those scenes are? Where they build to? Kind of what the themes are? And the comedy is there , but it just needs bringing out? Or did it feel like a bit of a disruption when you stood it up and were thinking ‘it’s not funny’. Where were you aiming for? And how do you think about comedy weaving into that process?

Holly:

I definitely felt exactly the way you described it like I was just getting up doing it. I wasn’t being too hard on myself. I knew that there was a show there. I knew that. Like you said, there was comedy in there, it just needed to be pulled out. so yeah, I think I think it was…it’s all right to start with. I didn’t feel negative about it or like it’s not funny. It just kind of amused me that I’d written this whole thing And I could just step back from it and just be like It’s not… It’s not what I thought it was. And I think that’s just because it wasn’t up on its feet and I wasn’t… maybe if I’d have acted bits out as I was writing it. But for that particular project I just found that I wrote it all. I think maybe because I’d done the course online and then I knew what the scenes had to be, and I was just like right. I just need to get this all out. I just need to bring up all these ideas. Get it down on paper to start with. And the fact that the show now is completely different to what it was there, I think that’s a good thing. I think it develops as time goes on, and I think that’s why people shouldn’t be so hard on themselves when they’re doing like a work in progress. Getting it on its feet in front of people. I think, don’t worry about it. Just do what you do. Enjoy it. There will be things that come out of it. Maybe you’ll be like that didn’t work at all. I’m definitely not going to do that. So I think just allow yourself to make mistakes. That’s another thing from Improv. They always say like mistakes are gifts, So sometimes when things go wrong, it could be the best thing to happen

Danielle Krage:

I think that’s brilliant and so true that you end up with something that you couldn’t imagine at the beginning. And also think it’s great – I don’t know if you’ve ever done stand up – but there’s so much that I love about the stand up culture, even though I’m not a stand up and I don’t want to do stand up…the sense of being willing to try things. Stand them up on their feet. Take what works to another iteration, and another iteration. So it’s not like trying to create some perfect thing on paper that doesn’t get tested until it’s put in front of the audience. So I love that kind of iterative process that you’re engaged with.

And from where the show is now, what are some of the things that you like best about the way that it’s developed? That maybe you couldn’t imagine from the beginning. What are you enjoying about it?

Holly:

At the moment. I’m enjoying the audience interaction. Obviously, it takes a while to learn the show to perform it. I think when you’re doing a work in progress, there will always be bits that you miss out or you get the order mixed up. So now that I feel like I’m at a really good place, interaction with the audience is really really funny and I think people are just so funny. I’ve done a couple of nights recently where I’ve like just taken a small section of the show and done it at like a sketch night kind of thing. And I didn’t really expect to have so much fun like there was. Yeah, like there was a really funny moment with a woman where I get audience members to get their phone out and look at their Instagram. It’s the Critical Voice character, so she’s like, really mean, but kind of weirdly charismatic at the same time

Danielle Krage:

Amazing,

Holly:

And this woman got her Instagram out, and I was… The joke is like whoever she sees on her screen, like whatever post comes up on Instagram first, I’ll say to her…’They’re earning more money than you aren’t they?’ And she looked at her phone. And she hadn’t really clocked what was on her Instagram feed, and then as I went to leave her, she looked down at the phone and realized that the last post to come up was of a baby. And then she just looked up at me and was like ‘It’s a baby.’ And I was like ‘Yeah. Exactly. A baby is earning more money than you. And it just really tickled me. How like confused, like shocked she was by what she’d seen on her phone. So I don’t know. Like you, Just get these really funny moments that happen when you’re willing to… and again, this is like, I keep talking about Improv, but another thing that helps with is just speaking to people and being willing to go off script for a little bit, interact with people, have fun, and then come back to it. So that’s been a really nice thing that I’ve been enjoying.

Danielle Krage:

Oh, that sounds so fun, so delightful. I could imagine that so clearly in my head. That’s great. And I love that you’re able to bring this really playful, fun approach to all of your work, which is so encouraging to hear. Sometimes I can take things far too seriously, and it’s such a great reminder that it applies whether your creating a sketch with one other person, whether you’re making a live show with an audience, or whether you’re actually thinking about those characters for a short film – how you can really have fun with them and bring such a fun world to life. And I’m sure that comes. It was such a great feeling watching your short film, even though the central event is a funeral. There was so much delight and tension and play and cringe in it. It was delightful, so I think the fun you’re having also comes through.

So as we bring this to a bit of a close, I’d love to ask a final few questions about the wider world of comedy and what you’re enjoying. Currently when you watch shows, what’s really tickling you?

Holly:

I’ve actually been watching some really bleak dystopian. I don’t know why. I kind of just really love it. Obviously we all had the pandemic and that was horrible. But like there’s just a part of me that really like craves a zombie apocalypse, just to kind of like see how if I was in that situation… I mean, there’d be no work. We wouldn’t have to go to work.

Danielle Krage:

No, it’s true.

Holly:

We wouldn’t have to worry about things like, obviously we’d have a lot to worry about, but there would be a lot of stuff we wouldn’t have to worry about. Social media

Danielle Krage:

Yeah.

Holly:

Wouldn’t have to worry about that any more.

Danielle Krage:

No.

Holly:

So I’ve been watching The Last of Us, which is a zombie apocalypse show, and I’m trying to think what else I’ve been watching Station Eleven, which again, is a very bleak Dystopian show. In terms of Comedy, I discovered Nathan For You like maybe a year ago and I realized that’s a really old show now, but it’s so funny.

Danielle Krage:

I don’t know that one.

Holly:

You know, Nathan Fielder…a comedian and writer,

danielle_krage:

Okay,

Holly:

He brought out another show that was on…. I think it was on HBO not that long ago, called The Rehearsal and it’s…

danielle_krage:

Oh!

Holly:

Yeah, you might have heard about it. It’s the idea that in life we don’t get to practice things. We just are expected to have difficult conversations, or you know, do life events that maybe we’re not, we don’t know how to navigate them. So he’s really really funny and really silly. and Nathan, For You is, he would go into businesses, say to them, ‘I’ve got a way to improve your business.’ And so, for example, one of them he did was, he went into a coffee shop that wasn’t doing very well and he was like, ‘I’ve got this great idea. We’re going to re-brand you as fake StarBucks.’

Danielle Krage:

Right,

Holly:

And they just had everything in there like exactly the same with StarBucks and they had to navigate like how do we not get sued And it’s super super silly. He did one where he went to a frozen yoghurt and was ‘You need to drum up more excitement about your shop. So I’m going to make a poo, flavored frozen yoghurt, and that’s going to bring people in. The whole show is just so stupid like you’re watching it like none of this makes any sense. But it’s the people. It’s actually the regular people in it that are funny. He’s almost the straight man. Yeah, it just makes you realize that people are so funny and if you lead them in certain directions, the things that they come out with or the actions that they take can just be so mad. So that is a really really funny show I’d recommend. and then also, I feel like I’m always Just watching the American Office

Danielle Krage:

Right,

Holly:

From time to time in the background just as my, like you know, like just a show that you just go to when you’re eating your dinner.

Danielle Krage:

Yeah

Holly:

How about you? Are you watching anything fun?

Danielle Krage:

I’m watching Atlanta at the minute, So now I’m almost at the end of season two, and oh, my goodness, it’s brilliant. So Donald Glover, who’s a total genius. But what I love about it, particularly as it progresses…what I love about how it progresses is the episodes start becoming like little short films that really have their own flavor, So,  like in sitcoms where you have like one bottle episode where it feels like a bit of a different show within the series. This one, as it progresses, there’s like so many where it’s like wow, okay, this episode really has a vibe. And oh, my goodness, I had no idea they were going to go to this place. So I never quite know what I’m going to get when I hit play on an episode, which I love. I’m really enjoying Atlanta at the minute.

Holly:

great. I’ll have to watch.

Danielle Krage:

Yeah, I have to ask you…so when you’re watching The Last of Us and Station Eleven, are you recasting it in a more comedic light in your head? Or are you enjoying the bleakness? Or you thinking…but if I did this and actually that could be pretty funny.

holly:

Um, I guess sometimes I’m thinking what would I do in this situation? And where would I be like? where would I be living? Like? sometimes I would just be walking down the road and just look up at an apartment, like a block of flats or something, and just be like that would be a good place to hide out.

Danielle Krage:

Yeah.

Holly:

And if I had a sniper rifle, that would be quite a good place. I don’t think the zombies could get up there.

Danielle Krage:

Amazing,

Holly:

But no, I think I’m not really casting it in a comedic way. I may be thinking like if something funny happens, I’ll be like right, that’s a funny idea for a sketch. But also I feel like when something is so well written, I find it hard to think of comedic ideas for sketches because I’m just so absorbed into the show that I can’t really, I can’t really think of anything else.

Danielle Krage:

Yeah. Now that makes sense. It’s giving you your disaster planning.

Holly:

Yeah.

Danielle Krage:

Like at an Improv level, you’re walking around going….What if what if it was an apocalypse? And where would I live?

Holly:

yeah,

Danielle Krage:

I love that. I also do a similar thing

I’d love to wrap up with a little bit of advice. Is there any advice that you’ve been given as someone who’s a writer, performer comedian, that you found really helpful, or if you’ve ever heard someone else give it, or received it.

Holly:

One of my favorite quotes is ‘No one’s coming to save you.’ Which sounds bleak, but it isn’t. Like, you could spin it that way, I suppose, but for me it’s like no one’s going to create what you want to create. So say for example, if it’s like comedy writing, and you’ve got…you really want to write a sitcom, No one’s going to write that for you and just be like her. Here you go. Or you know no one’s going to say. Oh, Danielle, could you please write me a sitcom it’s just not going to happen, especially with creative work. You know, our favorite shows and films. I doubt people asked them to make it. They just wanted to, so I think… try and think of that in a positive way.

Also in terms of like, if you want to make comedy sketches, if you’re making a sketch on your own, unless you kind of have connections, iIn that way, no one’s going to edit it for you and come up with a social media plan for you Like you need to kind of like say to yourself… Can I learn how to use a really simple editing software? Where can I go and find a course to help me with writing, if you know, that’s an area that you’d like to improve in. So I think of that as something I really like to work with and live by.

Other advice that I’ve been given… I had a friend Improv coach who once told me to always have five projects on the go at once, which was really really helpful, because at the time I felt a bit stressed and I didn’t really know what I wanted to do, but I knew that I wanted to you know write sketches and films and things like that, so yeah, they said to me, ‘Just always have five things and sort of see it like a fire like you’re kind of putting these things Into the fire and they kind of like cook in, And you maybe pull one thing out. Tend to that. Put that back in.’ And I think it also takes the pressure off, because if you’ve only got one thing that you’re working on, you’re gonna probably put a lot of pressure on yourself and on that. And then, if that doesn’t work out, then you don’t have anything else to fall back on. So definitely, yeah, try and have as many things on the go as you can. But then just focus on one thing at a time. when you do that.

Danielle Krage:

That is brilliant advice. I love that and it’s super practical. And I didn’t find that blea at all, your  r quote. I think it’s really empowering and inspiring.

Holly:

I said it to my mom before and she was just like. Oh, That’s not very nice. It’s good. It’s a good

thing.

Danielle Krage:

It is good. And I think that’s a perfect place to end because you can really see that in your work. In the work that you are making. And that’s why you won the award. And then that’s where you get the commission. But they didn’t come knocking on your door saying ‘Holly!’ You had to be putting yourself out there creatively, taking those risks, making things, improving, sharing, working with others to make those things happen. So retrospectively, if people only saw one part of your career, they might think, ‘Oh, that’s lucky,’. But it’s not. You’ve made that happen yourself and in such a practical way. And I love that you talk about it in such a fun, doable way, as well.  As a place where everyone could start.

Holly:

Yeah, if anyone wants to do it, like just collaborate with people. I’m sure there are either really talented people that you know or there are people that you could reach out to like. Don’t be scared to reach out to people, you never know. Even if you think well, they’re doing this and they won’t want to work with me, like you don’t know. Just just put it out there. Just be nice and friendly. Speak to them. See if they want to work with you. I don’t think there’s any… I think comedy can be tricky…. but I don’t think there are any barriers in terms of making your own work. I think there’s a lot of rejection out there, definitely, but I think there are enough opportunities out there, or just you start creating your own thing, maybe on your social media… for everyone to be able to do it.

Danielle Krage:

I think that’s brilliant. I think that’s a perfect challenge for anyone listening or watching to either make one thing this week. however tiny you feel like it is. Or to reach out to one person this week. You can see it’s really benefited Holly. And I’m finding that really inspiring to be like…. Okay, who do I want to collaborate with?  Whom am I going to reach out to this week? I love that. So thank you so much, Holly for generously taking us behind the scenes and sharing so many things about your process and giving us such great practical advice. I really appreciate it.

Holly:

Oh, no problem, thanks so much.